Tuesday, November 7, 2017
Misconceptions about guns
Once again guns are in the news in a big, and sad, way. The news media is full of new gun control proposals, and are also reporting a lot of things that are simply untrue. I'm not going to say they are necessarily being deceptive, but are simply misinformed. Let me give you some facts:
First of all, gun makers...Glock, Ruger, Smith & Wesson, etc...do not sell guns to the public. They don't have any factory outlets. They sell only to Federal Firearms License holders. Broadly speaking these are your gun stores. To get a FFL these retailers must go through an extensive background check themselves and pay a substantial yearly fee. They are also regularly and thoroughly audited. Every gun they get in, and every gun that goes out, must be properly documented. If the FFL holders aren't responsible, blame the government who improperly vetted them, not the gun makers.
Anyone buying a gun from a FFL dealer must have either a current state "License To Carry" a gun (which itself requires substantial vetting) or get approval from the Federal database that says they are not convicted felons, "wanted" for any reason, have never been committed to a mental institution for treatment, have no restraining orders against them, have never denounced their citizenship, have never been dishonorably discharged from the military, and a few other things, too. Failure to properly submit gun buyers for a background check can result in a major fine to the FFL dealer, or even the revocation of their FFL.
You can NOT just buy a gun on the internet, give them your credit card number, and have it mailed to you. You can buy one from an out of area FFL dealer and they will ship it to a FFL dealer in your area who will then process your background paperwork, and if you pass, deliver it to you. The local dealer will generally charge about $50 for his paperwork service.
Roughly 60% of all gun sales are handled through FFL dealers and are documented. The problem with this gun purchase database, known as the Federal Instant Criminal Background System, or NICS is that it won't work if all the courts around the country, both civilian and military, don't report all their convictions, restraining orders, etc. If those aren't reported, the NICS will have no reason to deny a gun purchaser. This is what happened with the Texas church murderer.
The problem is with the other 40% of gun sales. Federal gun law allows individuals to sell their personal guns to anyone they wish. This was meant to allow sales to friends, neighbors, relatives, etc, but it is sometimes abused by people who buy guns from any source they can, legal or illegal, claim them as their personal gun collection, and then resell them without background checks. All sales are off the books, there are no receipts given, and I doubt any taxes are paid by these sellers on their lucrative underground business.
Why would someone buy a gun this way? First of all used guns, like used cars, are generally less expensive. But there are also a surprising number of people who simply don't want the government to know they have guns. THEY DON'T TRUST THEIR GOVERNMENT. They fear that some day there will be a knock at their door, where federal agents will come in and rummage through their residence and confiscate their weapons. This fear is what sustains many "militias" dedicated to the preservation of the Second Amendment. Rational or not, it's a real fear.
Finally, and this is the REAL bugaboo in the firearms controversy, there is a thriving black market in stolen, untraceable guns. There is a forcible home burglary approx every 14 seconds somewhere in America, netting crooks 1,000,000 guns a year. When a burglar has a choice between stealing your TV, your laptop, your jewelry, or your guns, he'll choose your guns every time. That's because there is a vast underground criminal network that caters to those who can't pass a NICS background check. Think gang-bangers, convicted felons, criminals who consider a gun a "tool of their trade", etc. All these lowlifes know each other, and know any gun they can imagine is available for the right amount of green cash money, no questions asked. It's surprisingly easy to buy this way. (I'm told. I buy my guns the legal way.)
This last subset is responsible more than all others by a wide margin for our reported gun violence. The other loopholes can be addressed to some degree, but if that happens it will just drive more people to this criminal underground to buy their guns.
"But other countries have strict gun laws and their incidence of gun violence is minuscule compared to ours." True, but they don't already have 300,000,000+/- guns floating around their country. They don't have a 250 year history of private firearms ownership or a Second Amendment. Old habits die hard. Genies don't go back in bottles.
So what CAN we do? Concentrate on this last subset. When a convicted felon is stopped by the police for anything, search them, and their car. If they're found in possession of a gun, off to jail they go. Our cost to incarcerate will go up dramatically, but it will cut down on gun violence. How bad do we want it? The same goes for those who have been dishonorably discharged from the military. They should be treated the same as felons when it comes to gun possession.
The mentally ill need to be identified AND HELPED. Take away the stigma of mental illness, enabling those who need help to step forward and ask for it. Our societal cost to treat mental illness and provide mental health facilities and hospital beds will go up dramatically, but it will cut down on gun violence. How bad do we want it?
There ARE things we can do to address gun violence, but they will cost money, and no politician is going to advocate raising taxes to pay for them. The taxpayers want to have their cake and eat it too. Life doesn't work like that.
S
Very true post. You nailed the real problem.
ReplyDeleteIt is a balmy 27 degrees and Sunny up here, I have Texas on my mind.
Come on down. It's cool here, with rain and a high in the 40's tomorrow, but I'm sure this is balmy by AK standards.
DeleteNot that I want to contradict you but I'm aware of several people who managed to purchase guns on the Internet.
ReplyDeleteThen it wasn’t purchased through a FFL gun dealer, but from one of those underground sources I mentioned. I’m sure you associate with honorable people, but this is one of those black holes that those who are trying an end run around the system exploit, too often for very dishonorable reasons. This is where we need to up our policing.
DeleteA question Stephen: Are you sure they didn't buy the gun off the internet, but take delivery through a local FFL dealer as I described? That happens regularly, but the guns are not delivered straight to the buyer. Any other way I'm aware of would be illegal. But again, the dark gun underworld doesn't care about legalities, which is why THEY are the problem.
DeleteThe ownership of guns, how easily they are obtained, gun shows, etc, are never the issue, are they? It's something else. It can't be guns, per se. It just can't be, because that would be something basic to our life. We need guns. They are part of our existence. We need them. I need to know that when I go to bed tonight a gun is in my nightstand. I can protect myself from those bad guys who can come through my door, and, and, and........
ReplyDeleteMy god, we are so fucked if we really believe this stuff that the nra and the people who say gun laws can't, shouldn't, won't be strengthened. Because it can't help. We already have 2.5 to 3 million guns already, it can't be fixed. It can't be fixed. Fix that in your brain...."It can't be fixed". That's what they want you to believe. The only solution is more guns. Every person in church, school, wherever, needs to have a glock in a holster. An AR15 in the car, whatever, I dunno, claymores in the the trunk....Christallfriday. We are so screwed.
And don't tell me I'm ignorant of the subject, Lowandslow. I've been in actual combat, I've seen live fire directed at me. I know how people react to live fire. And it ain't going to be solved by having a few 'well trained' people with guns in each and every church, theater, concert, etc.
I'm so tired of people who know nothing, repeat nothing, of this subject telling us what we can and can't do.
Get rid of the guns. And don't tell me it's impossible. It's hard, but no other choice is going to work.
With all due respect Mike, your preaching here is more than a little pompous. I thank you for your military service, I truly do, but that in itself does not make you an unimpeachable expert. First of all, your numbers are grossly in error. We don't have "2.5 to 3 million guns already". We have 250 to 300 MILLION guns already, 100 times more than you stated. In a perfect world would I like to see all of them go away? Yes, that would save many lives for sure, but can you in your wildest dream explain to me how we can get rid of them ALL? The ones we likely could get rid of are those in the hands of law abiding citizens who might obey a government order to surrender them. But just looking at the facts, if you will just do that, you'll see THEY aren't the ones shooting up schools and churches and Walmart's and 7-11's. It's the criminal types who get their guns from the underworld gun sellers, who in turn likely get theirs in home burglaries and violent crimes. You have a beautiful vision, but you're in denial. As I said, yes, we can close some loopholes, which might help some, but the profit motive will always cause the underworld to keep stealing, and selling guns to the very ones who will do the most harm. We will NEVER win that war. What we CAN do is direct our limited resources and energy to stopping the hardest core violators and the helping the ones who suffer from the most serious mental illnesses. No, you're not ignorant of the subject, nor am I. The biggest difference I can see in our positions, Mike, is that you're not seeing reality. And if I might say so, your bitter tone here concerns me. I can almost hear your blood boiling. You're a doctor...please look at yourself objectively and take care of yourself. Thanks for reading and offering your experience.
DeleteYeah, pompous. I confess to that. I'd like to see fewer people killed, Yeah, I'm pompous. I, through typo, made the mistake by a factor of 10, the number of guns. My blood boils because I've seen the carnage caused by guns. England doesn't have this, Australia doesn't have this, only Yemen has, per capita, fewer gun deaths. Why oh why could that be?? Yeah, I offer my experience as a doctor. And I say, if we had stronger gun laws, banning assault weapons, we'd have fewer deaths. That's the experience of countries that have banned them. Would it take time? Yeah. Would it be effective immediately? No.
DeleteI'm not pompous, Lowandslow. I am a bit more concerned, what....immediate, on what happens to us as a country, with a 'leader' who want's to divide us more than unite us.
Thanks for posting this, it's more than many blogs do.
Mike
I, too, share your concern about our "leader".
DeleteI'm mostly with Mike on this. I didn't have grandkids when the Sandy Hook happened and was stunned by that shooting. Now that I have grandkids I can't imagine the pain simply because our do-nothing Congress, in the pocket of the NRA, keeps saying, "it's too soon," after every shooting. When is it soon enough to ban assault weapons?!
DeleteVery good post. I am in complete agreement. If guns are disallowed, only crooks will have access to them.Besides which, there are millions of privately owned guns in our Country, and in fact in every country. Do we want the rest of them available only through unlawful means? Because those people will still get them! And how could we EVER gather up all the guns out there now? That is MHO. Also, if people who have a thought for the earth and care about saving it stop having babies, I can assure those who are clueless will keep having them. There might be a child born who could turn things around, but not if they are just raised to hate.
ReplyDeleteI heard an interview awhile back with a gun dealer who said he had two good friends who both committed suicide with guns. He said it gave him pause.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure it did. Did he think he could have somehow prevented it? Did he sell the friends their guns? Did he think they might have been suicidal when he sold them their guns? There are lots of variables in our gun debate, and a change of just 1 or 2 can skew any possible solution. I would imagine it would take reforms on many different levels to show any overall reduction in gun deaths. It's a very complex issue.
DeleteYeah, L&S, imagine getting up before the parents of the kids killed at Sandy Hook, and saying "It's a very complex issue." Have kids? If so, imagine being one of those parents.
DeleteOh, and if you are tired of my responses, often disagreeing with you, you can do what Joeh does: delete any comment I make. Seems to work for him.
DeleteNo, Mike....I'll never censure you or anyone else. I want to hear various opinions. You always make the think, and whether you realize it or not, I've flipped on a few things after hearing your views. Sometimes we'll just have to agree to disagree, but I still want to hear as many opinions as I can, and I respect yours.
DeleteAnd I yours, pal. Though I may not often show it adequately. My bad. You try to do something few do: show two sides to an issue.
Delete